Surfing And Singing Through Uncertainty With Summer Macedo

 

How would you handle entering a competition without any guarantees that you’ll get the same opportunity as the other competitors? The next guest, Summer Macedo, has to battle this every time she enters the water in a surfing competition. Her performance relies on whether or not there are waves, which she isn’t in control of. This uncertainty has prepared nineteen-year-old professional surfer Summer for planning ahead but also taking life as it comes and spreading the Aloha everywhere she goes. In today’s episode, Summer talks about her work ethic carrying over from surfing into school, and how she’s trying to stay her true self through it all. She and host, Josh Martin, also connect on musical theater, financial planning, and athletics.

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Listen to the podcast here:

Surfing And Singing Through Uncertainty With Summer Macedo

This show is conversational. I’m interested in learning more about you, what’s you’re up to, what you’re all about. The concept of Journey For More is about people who are doing more than their traditional job descriptions. Something I was excited to hear is I was watching a clip about you and you were mentioning how important education and school are to you and having something beyond surfing. That’s something that speaks to me #MoreThanAnAthlete. How old are you? 

Nineteen.                                                                             

It’s reassuring to see younger athletes. It’s all relative. I’m turning 28 and I’m an old veteran at this point in the NFL. It’s cool to see younger athletes that get beyond the realm of football or in other sports. The thing that’s catching on in other sports as well.

As an athlete, physically you can’t do it forever. What are you going to do after that? I’m a planner. I’m going to plan my future and I want a backup plan. I want an education. I want job opportunities after I’m done surfing. I want to create as many opportunities as I can for myself.

I hear a plan. When I think of surfing, I don’t think of plans. You don’t control the waves.

No, but I control my entire competitive year in terms of events, traveling and training.

You have to be a really good free surfer to be sponsored, paid, and supported. Click To Tweet

Is it contrasting like you control your training schedule, your regimen, what competitions you’re preparing for, what competitions you enter but when you’re out on the board and you’re waiting for the waves, does that bother you on some level? Is that something that you’re used to with certain things being out of your control?

It’s something that I’m used to because I’ve been in the ocean since I was a baby. The whole concept of the ocean and not being able to control anything, in surfing, it’s normal for me. It is unique compared to other sports like football. I would think that there would be any guarantees. I was in an interview and they’re asking me to explain why surfing is unique. I was like, “You could be competing and there could be two minutes left and you wouldn’t even get an opportunity. You wouldn’t even get a last chance. The ocean decides for you.”

You might not even get a wave. 

There could be fifteen minutes left then nothing could come in or it could be pulsing into many waves. You’ll never know.

How does that impact the competition if certain people get more runs than others? How does that affect scoring?

That’s the way it goes. In competitive surfing, they take your top two waves in the time slot that you’re allowed. Usually, there are 4 to 2 people in each heat. It depends if you’re in the earlier rounds or if you’ve advanced to later rounds. The finals are down to two people. Until you get to quarterfinals, it’s 4 or 3 people. It depends.

My biggest question is are you at least guaranteed one wave?

No, you’ve got to catch that wave. There have been people that will paddle out and they will not catch the wave. When it’s big or something goes wrong, you break your board or your equipment fails in a way, something doesn’t work out and you don’t get the wave.

 

You don’t get a score and you’re out.

You could get great scores but other people could get even better scores. You could do amazing. Let’s say someone got a better wave than you, your wave wasn’t unspirited, it’s not even based off of your ability. You catch a better wave and you would get a better score.

You can’t predict which wave is going to be better.

There’s your knowledge of the ocean and surf break like how much you’ve been studying it, being aware of the ocean or making split-second decisions. Sometimes you’ll go on the wave before and the wave after is better. You don’t know.

I know football and film study, you’re watching the other team, what their tendencies are. How do you study the ocean in terms of catching waves and understanding the surf break? Do you go to the spot before or is there a certain preheat warm-up where you can get a feel for what’s going on or how the breaks are? 

I’ll tell you what I do before the competition. Before a contest, let’s say in Australia, I will arrive at the event area 2, 3 to 4 days in advance. In those four days, that’s your opportunity to surf as much as you can, get to know the break like you’ve never been there before, study it, see where the best waves are or where the best waves tend to come in. Try your equipment down because you could have a bunch of different boards for different conditions. A lot of times when you’re competing, the waves will change. You have to have everything ready for every condition. You take those days and you prepare as much as you can. The game day could come and the wave could be twice as big or twice as small. You take it out of the competition.

Are you allowed to leave the ocean during the heat or it’s like, “The waves are big, I need a new board,” and you swim back in? 

You can switch.

It counts still your time though? 

Yes. You’re taking away your time.

You want to make the best choice beforehand.

People do that. It happens frequently.

This is interesting to me. I’ve never talked about surfing before. You know what I haven’t done though, I haven’t introduced you. I’m here with Summer Macedo, World Surf League, superstar, Roxy Athlete, Surfing American National Title Winner, and NSSA National Open Women’s Gold Medal Winner, the nineteen-year-old pride of Maui. Summer Macedo, thanks for being here, making the long journey from Hawaii. Are you coming from Hawaii? 

Yes.

What are these seasons like? You’re in Australia, do you follow the waves and the seasons or do you surf in the cold? How does that work?

It depends on the time of year and what event it is. I was in Spain and it was cold. Maui, it’s hot all the time. I was telling Andrew that I love the rain here because where I live, there’s no rain. You have fall colors and everything.

It’s tropical though, a wet, damp environment in Hawaii or is that depending on the Island?

It does depend on the Island. The rainforests or different sides of the Island can be super tropical but everywhere is humid like 90% humidity. On top of that, it’s 90 degrees.

I’ll take my cold rain. I was watching another one of your videos and something you talked about after or before the competition but being from Hawaii and surfing for Hawaii, you’re interested in spreading Aloha. Being from the mainland, what the heck is Aloha? You see the movies and it means hello and goodbye, but you can spread it. It might mean something different to every person.

It does. I would define it as Hawaiian spirit in a way or our version of love. It can mean anything you want in a good way, not in a bad way.

I’m going to start using Aloha more often. We’ve been talking a little bit about surfing. I’m all about that #MoreThanAnAthlete. I listened to you sing. Is this the ukulele you were playing? 

Yes.

You have a beautiful voice. I love to hear more about what got you into that. I did some research. I know your dad is an artist. He has some dope stuff. I was like, “This is nice.” 

He’s from Brazil and he moved to the States. He became an artist and then moved to Hawaii and met my mom. They had been out there and he thought that he makes a living.

That creative spirit is in your genes it seems.

No one in my family’s remotely musical except for me. It’s an oddball thing. I don’t have anyone teaching me better ways or any mentors. It’s me doing it on my own and trying to find my voice.

How did you get into it? If you have no musical inspiration within your family, what drove you to sing and play?

When I was eight years old, I got cast in this play, Annie, in one of our biggest production theaters in Maui. It’s a huge production. I was one of the main little girls. I’d never done a play. I sing and I met this vocal coach doing that play. I started acting and doing that stuff when I was younger and I had fun with it.

I was also cast in a musical when I was younger at Denver Center Performing Arts. I was an understudy for the musical production of Nat King Cole & Me. I used to sing back in the day too. It’s in my blood. 

Do you still like it?

I love musical theater and I love the arts, which is why I came to school in New York. I’ve told this story before, but long story short, I was out later than I’d ever been on my recruiting trip. This awesome dude was ailing on tenor sax in the back alley and I played musical instruments as well growing up. I was like, “This is dope.”

What do you play?

I played alto sax, trombone, and tuba. I respect the hustle and the game. As you were saying?

When I was eleven, my little brother’s best friend’s dad, he loves to play the guitar. We got together and we started doing gigs for my school. We would play on May Day. I don’t know if you know that. It’s like a Hawaiian Lei Day. I play in a big production in our school and it was also at this big theater and it was him and me. I was twelve and I sang If I Ain’t Got You by Alicia Keys. That’s what started it. From 11 to 13, I played a bunch of school functions. When I was about fourteen, I started playing in restaurants with the same guitarist. My priority is surfing but if I’m home and my guitarist’s main girl doesn’t want to sing or she’s sick, anyone needs to fill in. I’m like, “I’m home. I’ll do it.” I’ll go and play with a band or I’ll play with a guitarist. I love it. It’s fun.

When I first started competing and traveling, I don’t know how my friends knew that I sang, not even my friend but my acquaintances. They knew that I had a voice and they would ask me to sing. I would sing acapella for them. I didn’t know how to how to play ukulele yet. It was like, “Mom, people are asking me to sing?” She’s like, “Why don’t you learn an instrument and bring it with you so that you can play for people?” I was like, “Okay.” That became my goal. I learned the ukulele so that I could bring it with me and play for people, share and have fun and then I started posting on social media. That’s for my fun. It’s not to go anywhere.

It’s something that you enjoy. That’s what it’s all about.

If that leads somewhere, then I’m stoked on that. If it doesn’t, then I have this entire other life.

I’m interested in staying on this more than an athlete theme. I’m interested in exploring what your other interests are beyond surfing and music. You spoke about how education is important to you. I’m a big believer in investing in yourself for your future after your sport. There’s a 100% chance that you will not be surfing in a finite amount of time. Being prepared for that is important. I would be curious to learn how you’re preparing for that now or if you thought of that. 

School has always been important to me and I’ve always been one of those students that if I don’t get A’s, I’m mad. When I do something, I put my 100% in. I’m like that with school, surfing, and music. When I graduated from high school, I was like, “I don’t have the time and the energy right now to start online college, which is what I want to do. I don’t think that I needed to go right into that.” I’ve been focusing on my surfing and that’s even allowed me to excel in that and be creative with my music at the same time. I have time for that sometimes. I don’t know when I want to pull the trigger, but I want to get at least an Associate’s online in college. Bachelor’s would be my ideal situation. I don’t know how I can do it.

Degrees are great and learning is awesome but what do you want to learn about? What would you have your degrees in? What do you love to do outside of surfing? I only asked that because I’m going through this experience or have been over the last few years. I’ve been playing football for a long time. I got a second contract with the Jets a few years ago at this point. A big thing for me was reconnecting with my passions and figuring out what I enjoy because similar to you, we’ve been able to do things that we enjoy for a living. You’re a professional surfer. You get paid to surf. I can’t speak for you but I can say this for myself. What I do next has to be something that I enjoy doing. I’m curious about what would you be doing after surfing is all said and done after these next 50 years when you’re finally done with surfing?

My mom is a financial planner and my grandpa has a firm. When I was in high school, I took a lot of Sociology and Psychology classes. I chose those electives. I was homeschooled. If I could make enough money and live on Maui doing that, I would but I don’t think that would be the easiest path for me, even though I love it and I have a passion for that thing like dealing with people and the psychology of everything. I love what my mom does and I watched her do it every day. She works from the home that we live in, has flexible hours and can work from anywhere. She can travel with me and work at the same time. I would be happy with that.

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I’m the oldest of six. I have three little sisters. My youngest sister turned twenty in September 2019. You got the same birthday, I saw that.

We went to Memorial.

What do you think?

I’ve been there when they’re building it.

It’s intense though. We think of the memories and what happened on that day. It’s one of those things that it’s necessary to reflect upon, remember and something that should inform your thoughts. Beyond that, I have three younger sisters. I’m treating you as my younger sister at this moment. You enjoy the subjects, Sociology, and Psychology. You like the lifestyle your mom can lead as a financial planner. What if I told you that a major aspect of financial planning is working with people and understanding how they think?

What happens with my grandpa’s firm is he has a condo in the neighborhood that we live on. We live right on the beach and he has these clients come in and my mom meets with them. She talks with them. She works on their things and I see that interaction every day. There is that aspect and it is a high-stress job, but I feel like I do good under pressure.

That’s the thing, being a professional athlete. You get used to performing under the lights. Do you ever surf at dark? They don’t do that. Is that dangerous?

You can’t see.

Can’t you feel the waves though?

On a full moon, it’s light enough, you can go and you can surf under the full moon. I have bad depth perception that it’s hard at the night times. I’ve only done it once.

We’re talking about what you wanted to do, sociology, psychology, financial planning, your mom.

I would get a degree in Finance.

That makes a lot of sense.

In a lot of jobs, you have to go and you have to get experience before you can even have the opportunities. In a situation like my grandpa, he was in Maui with us and he was like, “I see the way that you deal with people and the way you read people. Do you want a job with me?” I was like, “Grandpa, do you know what I’m doing? I’m on this path. Thank you for the opportunity. I appreciate it.”

Is it a standing offer though like, “That’s nice to have any time?” 

I love that my mom has all that freedom, but she loves her job and I admire that.

This is crazy because what I’m interested in, and Jake knows this as well, is financial literacy and personal finance. I was at the panel that you were supposed to be there. I’m planning on getting my Series 65 license, so I can give financial advice legally. 

What is that? I know there are two.

I thought there’s a bunch of them. I’m not sure. I know that the Series 65 is the one that allows you to give advice. I can’t sell specific securities, bonds or insurance but I can give financial advice.

Mom took that and she said that there’s a lot of legal stuff.

 

One of my good friends was telling me that they use double negatives and different wording to try to throw you off from the answers and when in doubt, say it’s a fraud. That’s what they’re trying to figure out to see if you’re going to be an ethical practitioner of finance.

Certified Financial Planning Exam, you study for it.

We’re talking to a championship surfer, nineteen-year-old about the CFP exam. That’s something we should make a note. Tell us more about this exam.

She’s been in school for this thing for at least six years but she’s been working at the same time. I guess people don’t pass it the first time.

I’ve heard that a lot of the tests are difficult.

She went but she didn’t pass but supposedly it’s normal. She’s going to take it again.

I’ll find out more when I take the test. 2020 Olympics are coming up. You’re switching back to surfing. CFPs, ukuleles, musicals, and theater. This is the place to be for the arts. Have you seen the Broadway show?

I saw Wicked when I was here a few years ago and it was the best night of my life.

I saw Wicked and it was a good show. Have you seen Lion King? Any musical on Broadway is going to be a big-time production. I saw Aladdin with my mom. You’re like post-Aladdin Disney. That all came out in the ’90s. Back in 2020, the summer of Tokyo first Olympics with surfing. What’s your plan for that?

First of all, I don’t have the ranking. There are several world tours, world champions from America that have already taken the spots, but I have dual citizenship with Brazil because my dad is from there. If I wanted to, I could switch my nationality but go back to the whole Hawaii thing, I’m proud to be from Hawaii. I’m proud to represent my home and I don’t speak fluent Portuguese. I have only been to Brazil several times. I wouldn’t ever feel right representing them. It was a moral thing for me. I would have more opportunities to get into the Olympics faster if I went that route.

Was the Olympics a goal of yours, would you say? 

This first Olympics, it’s going to be a lot better to be on the outside of it. It’s going to be cool. Don’t get me wrong, it’s going to be sick and it’s going to be amazing for the sport but I don’t know how it’s going to go.

They’re surfing in Japan too.

Japan is not known for its waves.

Is it going to be manufactured waves? Are they still going to be in the ocean?

It’s going to be in the ocean. I’ve been to the place where they’re going to hold it.

What do you think? 

They talk about having the Olympics in Los Angeles and France later on. That will be much better because if they had it in California, they’d have that in Huntington Beach. I’m sure that’s what they would do. That’s a lot better than Japan. A wave pool would be better for the Olympics. It will be fairer.

You can’t have some people getting a wave and some people not getting a wave. You don’t know the condition. Every other sport in the Olympics is in a controlled environment. You don’t have the same variables as surfing which is incredible. Could you imagine being on a football field and calling a play and then the field moves all of a sudden? The offense suddenly changes for whatever natural reason is on the goal line as opposed to being on the 25-yard line. That’s the analogy that makes sense to me. Does that seem accurate to you? Everything is constantly in flux and you never know, you have to predict.

One of the most important things in competitive surfing and what I’ve learned is you need to make decisions and you cannot be on either side of your decision. You have to be like, “This is what I’m going to do. I have to trust that this is the right thing.” There’s a 50/50 chance that it’s not going to be what it is going to be.

You have to believe in yourself. There’s no hesitation. You have to go. 

With hesitation, you fail 100%. A lot of times, I’ll be in heat, make a decision and I will know right away I lost the heat right there. It’s bad. It’s the worst feeling. You can try to come back from it. Sometimes it does work out. It happens but you can be like, “If I lose, I’m going to pinpoint this and I’m going to be like, ‘This is why I lost.’”

You still have to compete.

After you make that decision, yes, but if you lose, you’re out. There are no loser rounds.

When you lose the heat, you’re done. Is it all sudden death? 

Yes. I went to Spain in August 2019 and I lost the first round. I went home and I had to spend four days in this rural part of Spain. It was terrible. You have to fly home all the way.

You travel halfway across the world to lose the first day.

You have to be like, “I spent all that money. I spent all that budget and I made one mistake.” Getting to this time of the year, your rankings are important.

Why is it?

To qualify for the World Championship Tour, the most elite tour that you could be on, you have to be in the top six in the world on the World Qualifying Series.

There are only six surfers in the championship?

There are seventeen girls in the championship tour. Every year, the top ten girls stay. The bottom six get kicked out and a new six from the Qualifying Series come in but the Elite Tour can also compete on the Qualifying Series. It’s hard to get in.

There are ten spots that are already taken up by the top ten people from the previous year.

Yes, but the six bottom girls could be ranked top six on the QS.

The QS is another professional surfing league. How many surfing leagues are there in the Qualifying Series?

There’s the Championship Tour which is the top. There’s the Qualifying Series, which is a step-down. That’s how you get there. There’s the Junior Series.

Are you in the Qualifying Series?

Yes.

That’s not a League?

No, it is.

The Qualifying Series is a league. World Surfing League is the Qualifying Series?

Yes, but it’s all the same.

I’m trying to make sense of this. I was into League and Series.

I don’t even talk about it to people, to begin with.

I know Playoffs and Super Bowl, regular season.

If you try talking to me about that, I’d be like, “Okay.”

I want to learn more about the business side of surfing. You’re in New York for a reason. You’re a Roxy Athlete. You have other endorsements. What does that mean? You mentioned the budget. How do you get paid? I don’t know if that’s a private question? Generally speaking, not necessarily you specifically but how does a business of surfing work from your experience? 

Every sponsored athlete will be given a proposal and then you can negotiate, take it, decline it from these companies if you get a proposal.

The company seeks you out?

A manager could go and get you something or they could come to you. It depends. Roxy came to me years ago. I had won my Junior World Title. I didn’t start with that much and I didn’t know anything about contracts. Even now, I still don’t know anything about that contract but luckily, I’ve brought someone on my team to help me out and I’m appreciative of because I know nothing. In the contract, there’s a salary. The athlete will get a travel budget for the year and then they’ll be paid per month. For a competitive surfer, there may be incentives if you get a certain result in a contest. Let’s say you win first in a Qualifying Series event, you’ll get a bonus of $3,000.

In surfing, you have to bet on yourself with no hesitation. Click To Tweet

You’re a competitive surfer but you could be sponsored without being a competitive surfer?

Yes. That is harder to come by. You have to be a good free surfer to be sponsored, paid and supported. You have to help your brand in some other way which is usually video content like surf edits or surf movies. You put it out, do premiers and media. There’s this one girl from Australia, she’s in the big waves so she completely stopped competitive surfing. She’s a half model, half big wave surfer. That’s what she does. I think it’s unique to every surfer and what they want to do.

Free surfing and big wave surfing are different. Is free surfing like competitive surfing without the competition? Big waves, the waves are big.

Have you ever seen Nazare or Jaws or anything?

When I train in Hermosa Beach, there’s this Brazilian restaurant called Silvio’s. They always have these surfing videos on and the waves, the surfer is like a dot in the picture. I know they have the tow-in and they’re ready to go with the bodyboard on the back and they have to rescue. If you miss the wave, you could die.

Big wave surfing is so intense. Competitive surfing is intense in its own right. Big wave surfing is insane.

Potentially life or death.

The guy that connected Andrew and me, he does big waves. He does everything. I don’t know if I have an interest in that yet. Jaws is one of the best big waves ever. It’s worldwide known.

Is jaws a location? 

Yes, it’s a surf break in Maui. It’s where I live. My little brother starts Jaws and he’s almost seventeen.

When do we say Jaws, the surf break area, how tall of a wave is that, so people know?

The smallest it would be is 18 feet. That’s small.

How was the water this deep? 

I don’t know.

Is it like 18, 30, 40, 50 feet?

Some of the biggest waves are 80 feet.

Do that people surf?

Yes. It’s insane but I don’t know if I can do that.

I watch a lot of X Games and I feel somehow that’s relevant because surfing is an extreme sport. I get where you’re coming from. I filmed a web series this off-season called Making America. We talk about social issues that impact Americans. One social issue that will be very relevant to you that we discussed in LA was about climate change. I’d be curious to hear your thoughts and opinions on your experience in climate change being in the ocean often. Is that something that surfing is impacted by? What’s the play there? Does it impact it at all? 

It hasn’t been yet, but that it will be. It’ll be noticeable in the next couple of decades.

In what ways?

The rising ocean levels will be big. The ocean’s tides will get more extreme. I’m not that educated on it, but the tides are important for waves and stuff. In Maui, our highways are right on the ocean and they’re being eroded. They’re going to have to build a new road in the next twenty years.

Hawaii is an island, rising sea levels.

I don’t think that Hawaii will get covered.

Hawaii is fairly mountainous. They probably won’t get covered but there are a lot of low-lying areas along the shorelines. You said your house is on the beach?

It’ll be a long time before it rises that much because we have a big beach and everything like that.

I was interested in learning about social issues. Are there any social issues that are close to you that you care about or try to use your platform to bring awareness to? Is that something that you’ve considered? 

As far as climate change?

Anything, like climate change, education, going back to school, the value of education, financial literacy. Anyways you’re involved in your community, volunteering.

I’ve experienced how certain things happen in a workplace between men and females.

Like harassment?

I’ve experienced that. I’ve had people that I’ve seen and known for a long time that say inappropriate things to me. In my community, they feel like they know me in a way through my media, seeing me in the newspaper or through whatever knowing me. I’ve had a lot of people come and air out all of their problems to me. It makes me uncomfortable because the ocean is my haven. It’s my workplace. It’s my everything. It’s made me feel uncomfortable and I want to stand up and be like, “This is not okay.” Don’t talk to me about this. I’m happy to talk to you or socialize but this is inappropriate. I haven’t been confident enough. I haven’t gotten to the point where I’ve been where I can say that because I don’t want people to go and talk about me and be like, “She lashed out at me in the water.” It would go around my community fast. I bet that the guys that would talk about me wouldn’t say the whole story. I’m uncomfortable with that. That’s something that women have faced in workplaces for a long time. I am now being aware of it. It’s now happening to me and I am passionate about it. I want to stand up for women and be a voice in a way.

 

I’m sorry to hear that, that’s not okay. A big part of that is understanding that that’s not okay. You’re allowed to stand up. Finding your voice can be difficult. Being comfortable and confident in taking a stand is something difficult to do, especially you’re a public figure in your community. Your income is based on your image in one way or another. When you look at figures like Megan Rapinoe and you see that she’s polarizing. She’s taking a stand for something that she believes in and I believe in that she’s in the right in taking that stand and using her voice for good. It’s a matter of coming into your own. It’s a practice and it’s something that I’m practicing to this day. 

When I made Making America, I’m still in the process of making it, talking about these social issues. In part, it was informed by the Colin Kaepernick controversy. It’s polarizing but something that I believed in. For me, it was a matter of finding a way to take a stand in a way that was authentic to me. Something that I could be proud of, look at and say, “I did this my way. I’m comfortable with this.” Whatever comes with it, comes with it but at the end of the day, I’m comfortable with myself whether or not it makes a difference in the larger scheme of things. It’s important but it’s not as important as the way you feel about yourself.

If I do choose to stand up about it, talk about it or bring awareness to it, I need to be okay with people talking about me or the backlash that I may receive, which is hard for me because I am one of those people who wants to please everyone. I don’t want to be made fun of. I don’t want to be talked behind my back, but at the same time, I’m not going to hide or create a version of myself for other people. I’m going to be my true self.

That’s necessary. I was on a podcast with a young woman. Her name is Tara Mont. She’s based outside of LA, one of the beach cities. She did a podcast episode about people-pleasing or feeling like you have to be everything to everyone. Ultimately, you end up being against yourself or not being true to who you are. If you listen to the podcast, I had a great time at Tara. I talked a little bit about Making America and making a difference in your community and that kind of stuff. That is a great podcast episode that might help you out, think through some things and see how you might approach this. You did a great job, Summer. Summer Macedo, thank you so much for coming on the show. She’s a future superstar in her own right. You have a new fan in me. I didn’t know much about surfing. I don’t know any other surfers but I’ll be looking out for you. How can people find you? What’s your call to action? What do you need people to do to get behind you and support you?

Follow me on Instagram, @SummerMacedo.

Until next time.

Thank you.

Important Links:

• Summer Macedo
• Making America
• Podcast – Trust & Thrive with Tara Mont episode with Josh Martin
• Podcast episode – Trust & Thrive with Tara Mont episode about overcoming people pleasing
• @SummerMacedo – Instagram